ANTI Anti Voss Community

[The_Eliminator]

This is a thread which sole purpose is to show that we are against all this bickering about the voss needing to be nerfed.

The other purpose of this thread is to praise the all mighty Baur that can thankfully own the voss with ease :D.

[Krazie]

Baur & Voss are equal. Voss tends to win beacause not all of people know how to control the recoil with a Baur. It takes skill o.O''

[The_Eliminator]

The only times i have ever died to a Voss is when theres either more than two players, i am caught off guard, or the rifle rockets are fired at me.

I am very good, maybe lucky because i dont really feel the baur kick back all that much and so IMO its good to just full auto or single shot it.

The only gun i have serious trouble with against my Baur is the Krylov, its a default gun but can seriously own in the right hands.

[SmashMonkey]

i like the voss and probably use it all the time, but i feel like its fair, cuz you can use the voss too, just be better than me

[The_Eliminator]

i like the voss and probably use it all the time, but i feel like its fair, cuz you can use the voss too, just be better than me

Exactly! Now go spread this around our enemy thread! :D

[BIFF EXPLODER]

i like the voss and probably use it all the time, but i feel like its fair, cuz you can use the voss too, just be better than me

alot more people should do like this guy and think instead of rushing to a forum complaining about someone being better then them.

[Razzor7]

I don't see why they ever got rid of the M16. Think about it, an M16 owns both of our "futuristic" guns.

[[56AB]D|Pvt.Jones]

All the AR guns are a PITA. They all need to be toned down to give the rest of the 'normal' players a level field.

:D

[Alaz]

Don't know why people think the voss is over powered to be honest, its only better then the Baur at medium ranges, close and long range its much better to be using a Baur in my opinion.

[MandoAdenn]

Krylov > All.

[GunHappyBob]

Baur & Voss are equal. Voss tends to win beacause not all of people know how to control the recoil with a Baur. It takes skill o.O''

You know when your talking skill as it relates to a computer game your really talking about who can best move their mouse on a mousepad in the most accurate millimeters at a time. If you focused a camera on the hand of the best fps player in the world you'd probably think he was a seizure patient.

[I-AM-J3ST3R]

Krylov > All.

I concur.

and to people whining about the Voss....stfu and play...

[TheHeartSmasher]

There is already a thread about this please search the forums guys
http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18793

[TheRealWolfgang]

I killed three people in one clip with the Baur at a silo on Verdun today. How does it relate to this thread? Well, it doesn't. I just like typing the word Baur. Because the Baur is cool. It sounds like Jack Bauer. So when I use it it feels like a gun that Jack Bauer would use. And Jack Bauer is cool. Voss sounds like the name of a nerdy scientist. So when I use it I feel like a nerdy scientist. And nerdy scientists are not cool. So the Voss is not cool. And it should go without saying that Jack Bauer could kick a nerdy scientist's arse any day. So therefore, Baur > Voss.

mirite or mirite here, guys?

~Wolfgang

[Shellsh0cker]

There is already a thread about this please search the forums guys
http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18793

. . . You linked to THIS THREAD.

[Vikaman]

There is already a thread about this please search the forums guys
http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18793

Dude.... I hope You are sarcastic... Jesus, the fate of the Sir.'s has been seen.

[Basil.]

the voss is fine, does not need to be nerf. Stick to your word dice and don't nerf this game, like you did in bf2. We all remember bf2 don't we?

[Fakkamajakka]

I killed three people in one clip with the Baur at a silo on Verdun today. How does it relate to this thread? Well, it doesn't. I just like typing the word Baur. Because the Baur is cool. It sounds like Jack Bauer. So when I use it it feels like a gun that Jack Bauer would use. And Jack Bauer is cool. Voss sounds like the name of a nerdy scientist. So when I use it I feel like a nerdy scientist. And nerdy scientists are not cool. So the Voss is not cool. And it should go without saying that Jack Bauer could kick a nerdy scientist's arse any day. So therefore, Baur > Voss.

mirite or mirite here, guys?

~Wolfgang

Yes, but Voss rhymes with "Boss" and "Hoss" and both of those words kick ***. You just have one word, so the Voss wins.

[dirtywork]

# 1 = Baur (pure pwnage) # 2 = Krylov (Great all around rifle) #3 = Scar 11 (very under rated) # 4 Voss (the over powered voss is hype)

Keep in mind all 4 these are deadly in the right hands.... some more than others.

Spray and pray players love the voss because of the 40 round mag, but the voss really ends up getting them into trouble. Why? they spray 30 + rounds at one target hoping to get a kill... then running for cover to reload and try again. I will take the Baur or the Krylov over the Voss any day of the week.

[maniacmattie]

I like this thread. I'm sick of hearing the people that practically say, "I got owned by teh Voss so many times today, people that kill me must be noobs"

[blank1]

For goodness sake, CHECK OUT ACTUAL GUN STATISTICS AND FUNCTIONAL REVIEWS HERE:

http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18349

Plzplzplzplzplzplz

I'll give you a cookie

[blank1]

Yes, but Voss rhymes with "Boss" and "Hoss" and both of those words kick ***. You just have one word, so the Voss wins.

Jack Bauer prefers the Baur. That PWNS your argument.

:]

[Zaltehook]

Baur and Krylov FTW(everyone knows why they win, no need to go into detail). Spray-and-pray noobs can whore the Voss all they like. Nuff said.

ALSO: Scar11 for the "Jack of all trades and master of none." type of person.

[Argh...]

Baur is my favorite by far. Weird that none of you praise its awsome single shot ability for medium/long range. That is in my opinion its greatest strenght.

Full auto close range.
Single shot medium and long range.

Krylov owning when you go for headshots.

Vos i hardly use that one anymore.

[AlphaNut]

BJ-2 > Voss :D

Voss is nice against those far away targets, or when an enemy is looking away. But for real fights real men use real weapons - something like a Baur for example ;)

[MouseNo4]

Here is a bit of an idea of how weapons stack up. This is my kill/death sheet for all weapons in bf2142. Notice something?

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/8640/killsgw2.jpg

Look closely at my death counts. Notice the highest death count is from... who could have guessed!... the VOSS. What is next? The Baur? Nope! The Bianchi comes next. Surely the Baur comes next... nope! The Lambert is next. Finally, the Baur.

The Voss has way over 700 kills against me where as the Baur barely scrapes over 400. Geez i wonder why...

[The_Eliminator]

Baur is my favorite by far. Weird that none of you praise its awsome single shot ability for medium/long range. That is in my opinion its greatest strenght.

Full auto close range.
Single shot medium and long range.

Krylov owning when you go for headshots.

Vos i hardly use that one anymore.

Agreed.

[The_Eliminator]

Here is a bit of an idea of how weapons stack up. This is my kill/death sheet for all weapons in bf2142. Notice something?

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/8640/killsgw2.jpg

Look closely at my death counts. Notice the highest death count is from... who could have guessed!... the VOSS. What is next? The Baur? Nope! The Bianchi comes next. Surely the Baur comes next... nope! The Lambert is next. Finally, the Baur.

The Voss has way over 700 kills against me where as the Baur barely scrapes over 400. Geez i wonder why...

You didnt take into account PK rocket kills, Herzog kills, and the fact that these KD ratios are a load of rubbish and dont tell us much :D

[Vikaman]

Baur is my favorite by far. Weird that none of you praise its awsome single shot ability for medium/long range. That is in my opinion its greatest strenght.

Full auto close range.
Single shot medium and long range.

Krylov owning when you go for headshots.

Vos i hardly use that one anymore.

Though I confess that I use the Voss more now, (due to graphics lag, the Baur is hard to control (just like the Clark)).

I still say that 3 burts fire at medium range.

But, Agreed.

[rowdyman]

. . . You linked to THIS THREAD.

:laugh:

[Pirelli]

Krylov > All.

Krylov is my favourite as well :) . I only go with Voss if I'm on the EU team.

[Vikaman]

Krylov is my favourite as well :) . I only go with Voss if I'm on the EU team.

m3h...

Krylov while PAC
Baur while EU!

Scar aint that bad though...

[BIFF EXPLODER]

i think all the guns are balanced in this game, theres just alot of people that dont like to get killed, and when they use a weapon they think everyone is supposed to use it aswell or else they are a "n00bz0rz0rz0rz0r" or something like that.

[Erhardt]

You didnt take into account PK rocket kills, Herzog kills, and the fact that these KD ratios are a load of rubbish and dont tell us much :D
I think it's fair to say Mouse's point was still made, though. The overwhelming number of times he's died to the Voss is indisputable, and it's just silly to try and pass the argument that the number isn't acurrate because rocket and shottie kills aren't singled out. Sure, they're in the mix, but let's be reasonable here, that number is HUGE, and rockets and shotgun pellets only count for so much of that, and surely those are spread relatively evenly across all the assault rifles.

I also don't think Mouse was pointing out the ratio, so much as the obvious fact that the Voss was far and away the greatest contributer to him feeding the worms.

[karnstein]

@erhardt: Yeah, it's a huge number that's true. But it is meaningless without some secondary number (which do not show up in the bf stats).

Let me explain (not for you, I think you allready understand what I'm aiming at):

mouse has 11d playtime and over 8000 death, nearly 800 by voss. The only thing we can say for sure is, that none other single inf weapon has killed him that much. Besides that we know nothing, because we've got the following problems.

1. voss is an unlock weapon you can pick everytime, so you can't compare it with the stock weapon because you can't have them each round. 9/10 people stay away from the ganz, so they use shuko+bianchi... which summs up to ~900 death for him.

2. We know his total time with the voss and he knows his voss kills after a single round, because of the debriefing screen. If he used a watch to stop the time for each round he played solely as a voss-assault, he could get a useful number after say 30 rounds playing only assault. (kills per minute per round, average kills per minute of 30 rounds played).

But we and he don't know how many voss players where on that server for those 30 rounds, how many voss death he had in this rounds and how long those people stick to a voss-kit each round. Playing on a 32 player server where 50% of your enemy whore voss the whole round contributing 10 of your 15 deaths to this weapon has a whole different significance than playing on the same server when only 25% of your enemies use the voss resulting in the same 10 out of 15 death ratio.

The more people on a server use the same gun, the greater is your chance to get killed by it. That's an undisputible fact unless we talk about inf-weapons and you're vec-whoring the whole round. My assumption (no prove because I don't have the time and will to pick 1000 random players out of the DB) is that assault is one of the fav classes around and most people playing assault use the voss, unless we talk about people who recently started unlocking the assault class or playing the whole game. (and BF2142 is out now for some months) So the chance to join a server, where most people play assault using the voss on a inf-heavy map is far greater, than joining the same server where everybody sticks to assault+baur or assault+scar.

[Erhardt]

karnstein... yep, I agree exactly with what you're saying. I just think for the sake of this discussion, it's probably over-analyzing. The bottom-line of the Voss being his undisputed #1 killer is the simple gist of what he was saying.

The minutia of how he arrived at those numbers is certainly worth looking at in their own right, but in any case, the final numbers are what they are, and there's no doubting what they say. The Voss is an exceptional killer.

All that said, I don't think there's a problem with the Voss. I unlocked the Baur first, myself, and prefer it in most cases, though I did enjoy the Voss when I first unlocked it. I may go with the Voss on Berlin or the back half of Gibralter, or when fighting on a Titan, but for everything else, I'll stick with my Baur.

[NeeN10DoH]

Yeah the krylov is the best but voss is always useful because of the extra ammo.

Not really a baur fan, cant control the gun properly (im slow at using it) and the small clip.

[llGRIM-REEFERll]

I agree there bickering has to stop its annoying....
and even dice recognizes that they are situational guns
all unlocks are.....
the message at the bottom going around right now on the menu is:
Game Tip: Use the Buar for meduim to close range combat, but the Voss for close ranged combat

[RMcLeod]

.
the message at the bottom going around right now on the menu is:
Game Tip: Use the Buar for meduim to close range combat, but the Voss for close ranged combat

Really? I find the BAUR is great for long range on single shot, I out sniped a sniper with mine.

[Tr1663r]

I killed three people in one clip with the Baur at a silo on Verdun today. How does it relate to this thread? Well, it doesn't. I just like typing the word Baur. Because the Baur is cool. It sounds like Jack Bauer. So when I use it it feels like a gun that Jack Bauer would use. And Jack Bauer is cool. Voss sounds like the name of a nerdy scientist. So when I use it I feel like a nerdy scientist. And nerdy scientists are not cool. So the Voss is not cool. And it should go without saying that Jack Bauer could kick a nerdy scientist's arse any day. So therefore, Baur > Voss.

mirite or mirite here, guys?

~Wolfgang

whoa, now that's analysis! brilliant. :rolleyes:

[blank1]

Since no one bothers to click my links, I am going to copy and paste the ENTIRETY of my assault rifle break down.

This is taken from this thread (which I authored): http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18349

Introduction and Basic Assumptions

I'll start this off by saying I have no preference what so ever for any gun (I don't play under blank1 anymore btw).

There seems to be many people who swear by their preferred weapon, and a lot of people who curse that same weapon as "crap." Voss player insist their gun is uberpwnage, Baur users pretend they are gifts from the gods of BF, the Krylov shooters are roughly the same, and then you have like 10 people world wide who like the SCAR-11. I thought I'd throw down some real basic math behind all the rifles' actual performance, both statistical and functional, to do away with a lot of the bias and contribute to people legitimately in need of advice as for what assault rifle to use.

First of all, all of my information is predicated off the statistic that the Voss and Krylov fire 1.5 times faster than the SCAR-11 and Baur. The most reasonable RPM's, then, are 600 for the SCAR-11 and Baur, then 900 for the Voss and Krylov.

Time To Kill (in seconds) Statistics

First, I will cover raw death causing ability, which I will measure in time to kill.

NOTE: The first shot does not count towards total RPM, since a single click will send out a bullet at the same time for every gun. The bullets fired after the first are the statistical deviations.

First, I will cover the black sheep of the rifles, the SCAR-11. The SCAR-11 lays a guy down in 5 shots at 600 RPM. 600 RPM means that the Scar will fire a bullet every 1/10 seconds after the first shot is fired. This means that, should all 5 shots land, the SCAR-11 will kill a person in 0.400 seconds.

Secondly, there is the pea shooter (it sounds like a freakin' BB GUN!), the Krylov. A lot of people swear by the Krylov, a lot of people have their own preferences. The Krylov lays a guy down in 5 shots at 900 RPM. This means that, after the first shot, it takes 1/15 seconds for the next bullet to fire. Should all shots land, the Krylov will kill a person in 0.267 seconds.

Thirdly is the "noob cannon," the Voss. A lot of people are very very pissed off by how fast this gun seemingly kills people. However, some think its rubbish and use other guns. The Voss L-AR will kill a person in 6 shots and fires at 900 RPM. Each bullet after the first comes in every 1/15 seconds. This means, should all 6 shots land, the Voss populates cemeteries at a rate of 0.330 seconds.

Lastly, is the gun that every self-righteous, self appointed demi-god in BF2142 seems to use -- the Baur. The Baur will kill in 4 shots at 600 RPM. After the first shot, the lead is spewing every 1/10 seconds. Therefore, the Baur makes widows at a speed of 0.300 seconds, should all 4 shots land.

In a nutshell, in terms of raw time to kill, the rifle food chain goes: Krylov > Baur > Voss > SCAR-11. It's the math.

However, we have to look at the margins to get a better look at things.

In terms of TTK, the Krylov > Baur by 0.033 seconds, Krylov > Voss by 0.066 seconds, Krylov > SCAR-11 by 0.133 seconds.

Baur < Krylov by 0.033 seconds, Baur > Voss by 0.033 seconds, Baur > SCAR-11 by 0.100 seconds.

Voss < Krylov by 0.066 seconds, Voss < Baur by 0.033 seconds, Voss > SCAR-11 by 0.067 seconds.

SCAR-11 < Krylov by 0.133 seconds, SCAR-11 < Baur by 0.100 seconds, SCAR-11 < Voss by 0.067 seconds.

What do all these numbers mean? It means that the raw killing capability of all the rifles is minutely different at best. The largest margin of TTK difference is 0.133 seconds, which is between the Krylov and the SCAR-11. What is 0.133 seconds like? In the time it takes you to say "PWNED!!!1" ten clicks have passed. That is how much faster the Krylov kills than the SCAR-11. In the instance that you and your enemy see each other at the exact same moment and fire at the exact same time with the exact same accuracy, the SCAR-11 and the Krylov will kill each other at the EXACT same time, since the game counts damage not by fractions but by each whole bullet landing. Furthermore, the TTK difference between the all the assault rifles is too small to make any of a legitimate difference.

This is my theory: when DICE was balancing the assault rifles, they decided to balance them by making perform, in the raw, so close to each other that each gun could not possibly be overpowered. However, they did not want to give the same gun to every player. Instead, they gave each gun very different sounds, feels, animations, and skins. This gives the illusion that a gun is vastly different from its counterpart, where, statistically, they are nearly identical.

However, we must all remember that there is still a functional side to the the assault rifles that plays a very large part in each gun's performance.

In close combat, since all the TTK's of the guns are so similar, no gun is at a clear cut advantage. It's all about a blend several of conditions: who shot first, who has better cover, who has better aim, and most importantly, who has better support from team members. All these come into account to determine who walks away and who gets to meet Saint Peter.

In combat range (range where you cannot place all your shots back to back to achieve your gun's fastest TTK), functions start to differentiate. The Krylov and the Voss will start to land some leg and arm shots, while some shots will completely miss due to those rifles' higher bullet deviations, the Baur will be forced into single shot or two shot burst, and the SCAR-11 can throw out 3 - 4 shot bursts. In this area, the Krylov and the Voss are all about volume and suppression. Throw out more lead and you will land more. The Baur is all about precision. Two well placed 2 shot bursts, or accurate single shot fast click. The SCAR-11 is a mix of volume and accuracy, since you can pump out 3 - 4 shots very, but not totally accurately. The Baur, as I've experienced, is the only rifle where you should expect to land every shot that you fire. In theory, this puts the Baur at an advantage... but that's assuming we're all robots with 100% perfect, programmed aim. Lastly, one could even argue that due to the SCAR-11's better balance of accuracy vs. recoil, it is, functionally, at a slight advantage in combat range. One could argue not, as well. The 4 assault rifles, once more, perform only microscopically differently, and once again, an illusion of vastly different guns is presented by having each gun do the same thing in a different way. It's like racing 4 riced-up Civics down the block, but each car has completely different stickers.

Deviation, kills per clip, Other additional Information

The SCAR-11 and Krylov both kill in 5 shots, have 30 shot clips, and 6 clips total. They have exactly 6 kills against heavy armor. The Voss kills in 6 shots and there are 40 rounds in a clip, with 5 clips total. This means the Voss has 6 kills + 4 bullets in each clip. The Baur, killing in 4 shots, has exactly 5 kills in a clip. Functionally, The SCAR-11 and Krylov should score 5 kills in a clip, the Voss should do the same, and the Baur should score 4 kills in its clip. Basically, the Baur has 1 less kill per clip, in function, than the other guns.

Also, in terms of base deviation (accuracy), the guns go in this order SCAR-11=Baur>Krylov>Voss.

Deviation is defined as the distance that a bullet will stray from your crosshair, at random, when you fire. The lower the number, the better.

Here are the stats.
The SCAR-11's base deviation is 2, and its kill shot (5) deviates at 3.3.
The Baur's base is 2, and its kill shot (4) deviates at 3.1
The Krylov's base is 2.3, and its kill shot (5) deviates at 3.36
The Voss's base is 2.5, and its kill shot (6) deviates at 3.84

NOTE: The SCAR-11's base deviation is the same as the Baur's but its deviation per shoot (0.26) is better than the Baur's (0.275). This means that after the first shot, the SCAR-11 actually becomes more accurate than the Baur. However, the Baur both begins and ends its minimum shots to kill at equal or lower deviation. This means that the SCAR-11 has the most accurate burst fire among the assault rifles. In contrast, the Voss begins higher and ends higher than the other assault rifles. This makes it the least accurate.

To help one visualize the actual difference in deviation, I'll present something simple. The SCAR-11 and Baur, at combat range (once more; the range where you cannot hope to land all shots necessary to kill in one burst, but you aren't required by the range to go into single shot), can land most if not all of their shots fired. The Baur, firing 2 shot bursts or single shot, should land all of its shots on the torso. The SCAR-11, firing 3 - 4 shot bursts, should kill in 2 bursts. However, the Krylov and Voss, because of their higher deviations, will land many leg/arm shots or completely miss their target if fired like a SCAR-11. This is where you take advantage of those rifles' higher rates of fire and pour out more volume of rounds.

Basic Weapon Reference

***NOTE***: No matter the assault rifle, please, aim at the head. That's a 2 shot kill across the board.

The Baur H-AR -
This gun kills in 4 shots, and shoots at 600 RPM. It's time to kill (TTK) rating is 0.300 seconds. The gun has the highest bullet damage of all the assault rifles, and its deviation is the best (along with the SCAR-11) among the assault rifles. However, this gun also has the heaviest kick of all the assault rifles, meaning that if one should use this rifle, one must learn to control its recoil before unlocking its true potential. This weapon does have a higher learning curve than the other weapons, but it's pretty much just a day of working out the kinks. In close range (range where you can burst 4 shots and have them all hit the trunk of your enemy), it's best to fire 4 - 5 shot bursts. At the nearer stretches of combat range, you should fire 2 shot bursts in quick succession. Because of the Baur's accuracy, you should score a kill after 2 bursts. At the longer stretches, you should fast click the gun in single fire mode. Don't tap too fast, but fast enough so that your TTK is low and your accuracy is high. You will routinely score 4 shot kills, and you shouldn't take more than 6 shots unless your target is moving perpendicular to you.

Voss L-AR -
The Voss kills in 6 shots at 900 RPM. It's TTK is 0.330 seconds. This gun has the weakest bullet damage of all the guns, and the highest base and kill shot deviation. However, its recoil is almost non-existent. This means that the weapon may function more as a more accurate weapon in the hands of certain players. This gun is also used by everyone and their dog, so expect to see crap loads of it. In close range, fire off your minimum shots to kill in 1 burst, and if that doesn't do it, rinse and repeat. At combat range, remember that volume of controllable fire is your advantage over the Baur and SCAR-11. You can do this in a number of ways. You can throw out 3 - 4 shot bursts in rapid succession, or just fire off 6 shot bursts, rinse and repeat. You should never, ever, under any circumstance (other than extremely long ranges) use this gun on single shot. I do not know why this gun has a single shot mode. Don't single shot.

Krylov FA-37 -
The Krylov kills in 5 shots at a speed of 900 RPM. This gives it a TTK of 0.267 seconds. This weapon does slightly more damage than the Voss and has slightly better deviation. However, in function, it works much like a Voss. However, the Voss has a higher buffer zone for missing in its clip, so make sure that you try your best to be accurate. In close range, shoot off your 5 shot kill burst. At combat range, I recommend pumping out a large volume of rounds, in the fashion of the Voss, but I do not recommend firing off 6 shot bursts. Rather, fire in rapid 3 shot bursts, trying both to accurately hit (remember that you cannot help some of your shots deviating and hitting an arm, leg or missing) and put out as much lead as possible.

SCAR-11 -
I honestly don't know why people hate this gun. I find that it behaves much more consistently then the other guns, and you can use it similarly in both close range and combat range. This gun kills in 5 shots at 600 RPM. That's a kill in 0.400 seconds. In close range, you do the same as the other rifles and fire off your 5 shot kill bursts. Now, this is where the SCAR-11 is unique. Because of its fantastic deviation, coupled with its easily controllable recoil, the SCAR-11 has to adapt much less then the other guns at combat range. What does this mean? At combat range, you can fire 3 - 4 shot bursts off in rapid succession and hope that most if not all of your bullets will land where you've aimed. This means you should get little ammo inefficiency, and you will not have the need to single shot like the Baur. Basically, the SCAR-11 is the most accurate rifle during burst fire, and you can burst fire it accurately regardless of the range.

Quick note: The recoil food chains looks like Voss>Krylov>SCAR-11>Baur.

Conclusion

The conclusion? Use what ever gun you like the best, because it does not make any difference what you decide to use.

[JackG2]

i think all the guns are balanced in this game, theres just alot of people that dont like to get killed, and when they use a weapon they think everyone is supposed to use it aswell or else they are a "n00bz0rz0rz0rz0r" or something like that.

Drives me crazy and reminds me of BF2's glory days where almost everyone started complaining about getting killed by SF unlocks, and how it was considered "cheating" to use one.

[karnstein]

Since no one bothers to click my links, I am going to copy and paste the ENTIRETY of my assault rifle break down.


Pah, I've read it days ago and I agree with you...but: Everybody who thinks teh v0ss is l33t or ueberbr0ken, has either slept at school real hard, when their teachers had talked about math and the difference between an opinion and a hard fact (not those hard facts from the dark side of the net ^^) or they are just to damn pig headed to accept the facts and DICE coder statements regardless how many times you confront them with them.;) Nice topic btw, funny&informatrive to read.

[Erhardt]

Since no one bothers to click my links, I am going to copy and paste the ENTIRETY of my assault rifle break down.

Conclusion

The conclusion? Use what ever gun you like the best, because it does not make any difference what you decide to use.
Wins the thread! LOL

Seriously man, good work, very enlightening read.

[simjay]

Those guys are morons. Weapons are made to kill. Don't like it, learn to adapt.

I dont normally use it, but it doesn't seem very powerful.

[Fakkamajakka]

Here is a bit of an idea of how weapons stack up. This is my kill/death sheet for all weapons in bf2142. Notice something?

Look closely at my death counts. Notice the highest death count is from... who could have guessed!... the VOSS. What is next? The Baur? Nope! The Bianchi comes next. Surely the Baur comes next... nope! The Lambert is next. Finally, the Baur.

The Voss has way over 700 kills against me where as the Baur barely scrapes over 400. Geez i wonder why...

That more of your opponents use the Voss against you than the Baur? That more people use the Voss in general? How far away are your attackers when they kill you? Do you do a lot of CQC or is it at range? You are providing inconclusive evidence.

This is getting tiring. Unless someone can mathematically prove in some way that the assault weapon A is significantly better than the assault weapon B, C or D then can't we just shut up and play with whatever gun we like best?

I like the Voss best because I like to charge the enemy guns a' blazing. I like CQC because my frame rates are pretty low and firing at range doesn't yield great results because of the frequent frame stutter. I like the scope on the Voss and Baur, dislike the Krylov scope and don't even remember what the Scar-11 scope is like.

When I die from someone's weapon, I'm ticked, but not because of their weapon. I'm ticked because they got the drop on me or because they shot me better.

[vbl]

I don't like the Voss (it's the Honda Civic of guns), but I support your right to use it.

[Casper]

Voss is just fine. There are many other things in the game that need fixing and the Voss is not one of them.

[blank1]

BTW, how many times you've been killed by the Voss in stats is SO misleading. Everyone AND their extended families use the Voss. I'm sure a lot of new people that play classes other than assault are sure that the Voss is the standard assault rifle. You see Voss's abundant as babies in a Chinese whorehouse, some Krylovs on PAC, a few Baurs here and there, and then 1 guy on the server decides to use the SCAR-11 for .0005 seconds for giggles, and most people are like "WOW A NS UNLOCK HOLY CRAP!"

[Vikaman]

See, the problem is that the Voss is too easy of a weapon to use, and many people take advantage of this, and complain.

You will have to agree that it is way too easy of weapon to use. Its skill lies in the people who want long range fire. Even that is very easy once you know how to use the Voss for long range shots (NO I do not mean PK rockets.)

The fact that it is weak and accurate with a high clip capacity makes it superior to the Baur and other assault rifles at close range combat. All Assaut rifles are made to work at short - medium range combat. The Voss just brings itself into the very close range combat (shotgun catergory) and can extend itself to the long range category (if the user knows how to use it properly.)

Weapons like the Krylov and Scar are basic weapons for a reason, one lacks power the other lacks accuracy making them disadvantaged in their own situations. The Baur has its disadvantages in close range combat, due to the clip size. If you do manage to put 3 into the enemy, he is f@cked. Otherwise, consider yourself eating lead.

The Voss is too versatile. It can work in any situation, and WITH a PK combo, it has ALL ranges under its belt.

This isnt a rant, but just explaining why I feel it is SLIGHTLY overpowered.

I SAID SLIGHTLY

[blank1]

I disagree with the entire notion that the Voss is over powered. Is it the most obvious to use correctly? Heck freakin' yes. That doesn't make it either better or worse. Do you want to know the truth? READ MY ASSAULT RIFLE BREAKDOWN. Kek. I posted in this thread a few pages back, and you can find it in the Tips and Tricks forums under the name "Assault: Which AR should you use?" It covers time to kill, kills per clip, functionality, recoil, deviation, and etc. Please realize that no assault rifle is inherently better than another. A player is better that a player, or another player is more fortunate than another player.

BTW, the Voss has the 2nd worst time to kill and worst deviation among the assault rifles. Food for thought.

In close range, none of the guns are at an inherent advantage, other than the fact that the Voss has an average of 1 more kill per clip, in function. At longer stretches, its like shifting from (if you're familiar with economics) Perfect Competition to Monopolistic Competition. The guns are all basically able to perform just as well as the others. They just do it differently.

[TheRealWolfgang]

Someone should do an analysis of all the assault rifles to end this confusion. Now where could we find something like that? In all these threads I haven't seen anyone post some concrete evidence that the Voss is or isn't overpowered. That would end all this debate, wouldn't it?

;)

~Wolfgang

[Vikaman]

Ya, but is not possible, it depends on the skill level of the person using it.

I can, for the life of me, use the voss for 90 + meter shots, even 120+.

But others say that voss is for 0 - 80 meters.

Hence It cannot be tested.

Unless you want to PROVE that it can be done. That is possible.

[TheRealWolfgang]

I was being facetious. blank has mentioned his AR analysis about 10 different times throughout these few threads, so I was just jabbing. ;)

~Wolfgang

[Vikaman]

Ohhh, slow me... :(

[The_Eliminator]

The best way for people to stop complaining about the voss is:

Pick up ad master the Baur (a.k.a Beat, God, Maximum (anythign thats sounds Big and Strong)

I own all Voss users at any range especially long range unless there are about 5 of them and they flank me.

[Storm]

The best way for people to stop complaining about the voss is:

Pick up ad master the Baur (a.k.a Beat, God, Maximum (anythign thats sounds Big and Strong)

I own all Voss users at any range especially long range unless there are about 5 of them and they flank me.

id like to see it. cuz any non-retard can beat alot of weps at range with the voss

[Yezo]

Honestly, I dont know why people complain about the voss. Its just overused. Of course you'll get killed by it a bit when more people use it, but that doesn't mean its any better. In fact the only thing that determines its success is whether he's able to get off the initial shots, or accurately fire the weapon at ranges.

Here are my Krylov kills. I dont see nearly as many people complaining about the krylov. It is just as effective, just not as used.

http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/2751/tb214201nj4.jpg
(http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tb214201nj4.jpg)

My voss kills. Nothing special.
http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/2325/tb214202mz9.jpg (http://img99.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tb214202mz9.jpg)

To all the morons who were complaining about dying from the voss the most. Think again... APMs, grenades, alone, have a greater factor in your deaths. Furthermore you dont even have to aim using APMs.

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/878/tb214203fg6.jpg (http://img99.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tb214203fg6.jpg)

[Raidyr]

See, the problem is that the Voss is too easy of a weapon to use, and many people take advantage of this, and complain.

You will have to agree that it is way too easy of weapon to use. Its skill lies in the people who want long range fire. Even that is very easy once you know how to use the Voss for long range shots (NO I do not mean PK rockets.)

The fact that it is weak and accurate with a high clip capacity makes it superior to the Baur and other assault rifles at close range combat. All Assaut rifles are made to work at short - medium range combat. The Voss just brings itself into the very close range combat (shotgun catergory) and can extend itself to the long range category (if the user knows how to use it properly.)

Weapons like the Krylov and Scar are basic weapons for a reason, one lacks power the other lacks accuracy making them disadvantaged in their own situations. The Baur has its disadvantages in close range combat, due to the clip size. If you do manage to put 3 into the enemy, he is f@cked. Otherwise, consider yourself eating lead.

The Voss is too versatile. It can work in any situation, and WITH a PK combo, it has ALL ranges under its belt.

This isnt a rant, but just explaining why I feel it is SLIGHTLY overpowered.

I SAID SLIGHTLY

Agreed 100%, the Voss is not so much as overpowered, as it is easy to use. Too easy.

[CRIMS0N_W0LF]

Long range you eat headshot from my zeller.
Meduim range you eat headshot from my zeller.
Short range you eat a RDX.

Stop complaining about guns master the use of a gun and you will own with it. Personally I prefer using Baur over Voss while Assult on SINGLE SHOT MODE ALWAYS. Yes single shot. Learn to aim :P

[Mongo Only Pawn]

Shouldn't there be something to the fact that the Voss is an UNLOCK, therefore should be BETTER than the other guns?

[Vikaman]

Shouldn't there be something to the fact that the Voss is an UNLOCK, therefore should be BETTER than the other guns?

It is a bit superior to the Baur (For Un-skilled players that is)

Voss - User Friendly
Baur - Challenging.

[Vikaman]

Shouldn't there be something to the fact that the Voss is an UNLOCK, therefore should be BETTER than the other guns?

It is a bit superior to the Baur (For Un-skilled players that is)

Voss - User Friendly
Baur - Challenging.

[TB-303]

lol, I wish everyone should STFU. It's the GANZ that pwns, as long as you've got the skill to use it of course.

heheh, only kidding. Each to their own right. After all, some people prefer the stock assault rifles to the unlocks.

All the weapons (including APM's and sentry guns) need 'skill' to use 'effectively'. Everyone just has their preferences and styles of play is all.

As for the eternal Voss vs Baur.....well at this time, I've got exactly 241 kills with each one, with the Baur having a better accuracy but the Voss getting more shots on target (because I've fired more shots with it). For what it's worth, I favour neither, it all depends on the map, my role in the squad and the objective we're given to complete. Same as every other kit and piece of equipment in the game.

As I said before....don't bring a fart to a knife fight.

[RottnJP]

Shouldn't there be something to the fact that the Voss is an UNLOCK, therefore should be BETTER than the other guns?

EXACTLY what I've been saying!! Look at the numbers- the Krylov pwns- the Voss needs to be buffed!! DICE, please give the Voss the stats it should have as an unlock! :D

[Shellsh0cker]

EXACTLY what I've been saying!! Look at the numbers- the Krylov pwns- the Voss needs to be buffed!! DICE, please give the Voss the stats it should have as an unlock! :D

The unlocks aren't supposed to be better than the regular guns, they're supposed to be different.

[nosoupforyou]

baur users really annoy me in the way they complain the voss is too good but then say the baur is better. They also make out like their somehow better than voss users because the baur takes "skill". I disagree, I consider it a close relative to the svd crossed with a g3 and its really not hard to pop 2-3 rounds into a guy once hes stood still.

Voss and Baur are nothing but Different both have their disads and ads and anyone who says otherwise is a fool.

I was good with the voss so no im not one of those noobs who just found it easy to use, i went from 1000th with it to 400th in a week or so and had much less play time than other players up there. I also knew a top 10 player and i was better than him with the voss.

baur users who think there gods gift because they use a glorified sniper rifle just stop, because your just annoying little ego padders.

[nemesis908]

alot more people should do like this guy and think instead of rushing to a forum complaining about someone being better then them.

Like being "better" has anything to do with it, and of course the majority are going to agree with you, because they spam the voss like rabid n00bs too.

I wouldnt mind dying to a voss user if the weapon was balanced and if i thought the player had/used any skill.

[JackG2]

The unlocks are supposed to be better than the regular guns, they're supposed to be different.

I was sure unlocks were just an alternative to the basic guns. You know? Just something else to play with to keep the game interesting.

[BIFF EXPLODER]

Like being "better" has anything to do with it, and of course the majority are going to agree with you, because they spam the voss like rabid n00bs too.

I wouldnt mind dying to a voss user if the weapon was balanced and if i thought the player had/used any skill.

dude... everyone knows that the weapon is balanced you know whats most balanced about it? YOU CAN USE IT TOO!.............................

u know what? when i use the voss i get killed aswell WOW that must be a completelly new concept to you huh? any other weapon can kill a guy with a voss IT ONLY NEEDS A SKILLED PLAYER SHOOTING IT and i can see from your post thats not your case.

[Shellsh0cker]

I was sure unlocks were just an alternative to the basic guns. You know? Just something else to play with to keep the game interesting.

Oh whoops, totally meant to type "aren't" there.

[nemesis908]

dude... everyone knows that the weapon is balanced you know whats most balanced about it? YOU CAN USE IT TOO!.............................

u know what? when i use the voss i get killed aswell WOW that must be a completelly new concept to you huh? any other weapon can kill a guy with a voss IT ONLY NEEDS A SKILLED PLAYER SHOOTING IT and i can see from your post thats not your case.

Yeah i can use it too, but why would i want to lessen myself?

You just dont get it do you? It's not about Voss users being invincible, it's about the unfair advantage that this UNBALANCED weapon gives a player.

You can't see **** from my posts because clearly you dont understand what i'm saying in any of them, and like that actually means anything coming from a Voss user anyway.

[BIFF EXPLODER]

Yeah i can use it too, but why would i want to lessen myself?

You just dont get it do you? It's not about Voss users being invincible, it's about the unfair advantage that this UNBALANCED weapons gives a player.

You can't see **** from my posts because clearly you dont understand what i'm saying in any of them, and like that actually means anything coming from a Voss user anyway.

voss users invencible??? HAH! dont make me laugh:rolleyes: i'm an engineer i only sometimes use the voss, btw, if voss users are invencible and i'm still able to kill them with the engineer SMG does that mean i'm GOD? :laugh:

get some skill and quit complaining.

[nemesis908]

voss users invencible??? HAH! dont make me laugh:rolleyes: i'm an engineer i only sometimes use the voss, btw, if voss users are invencible and i'm still able to kill them with the engineer SMG does that mean i'm GOD? :laugh:

get some skill and quit complaining.

You absolute moron, i said it's not about Voss users being invincible. Learn to read, and understand what you're reading, Christ there are primary school children able to grasp that concept quicker than you.

I'm infinately more skilled than you are.

[BIFF EXPLODER]

You absolute moron, i said it's not about Voss users being invincible. Learn to read, and understand what you're reading, Christ there are primary school children able to grasp that concept quicker than you.

I'm infinately more skilled than you are.

yep... infinately.......:rolleyes: you are my hero and when i grow up to be a piece of **** i'll want to be just like you.:laugh:

"oh noes the v0sSz0rz i5 1nViNc1bLz0r" i allmost feel feel sorry for you...

u want a lolly to make you stop crying? ahahahaha

[nosoupforyou]

You absolute moron, i said it's not about Voss users being invincible. Learn to read, and understand what you're reading, Christ there are primary school children able to grasp that concept quicker than you.

I'm infinately more skilled than you are.

that statement about voss users being invincible implies that its a fact but its not relavent to this debate..... Both are wrong they arnt invincible and it is relavent =p =p =p learn to write.

[Razzor7]

yep... infinately.......:rolleyes: you are my hero and when i grow up to be a piece of **** i'll want to be just like you.:laugh:

"oh noes the v0sSz0rz i5 1nViNc1bLz0r" i allmost feel feel sorry for you...

u want a lolly to make you stop crying? ahahahaha

The first time you posted, it could be written off as a stupid mistake/misread. The second time you posted, it's grounds to hang you for stupidity.

HE. IS. NOT. SAYING. THAT. VOSS. USERS. ARE. INVINCIBLE. THIS. IS. SHOWN. BY. THE. STATEMENT. "IT'S >>>NOT<<< ABOUT VOSS USERS BEING INVINCIBLE".

[blank1]

According to actual, 100% accurate statistics and field tests, the Smoke Grenade is THE most versatile, and deadly tool on the battlefield. Nerf.

[nemesis908]

yep... infinately.......:rolleyes: you are my hero and when i grow up to be a piece of **** i'll want to be just like you.:laugh:

"oh noes the v0sSz0rz i5 1nViNc1bLz0r" i allmost feel feel sorry for you...

u want a lolly to make you stop crying? ahahahaha

This kind of derogatory comment shows your caliber.

that statement about voss users being invincible implies that its a fact but its not relavent to this debate..... Both are wrong they arnt invincible and it is relavent =p =p =p learn to write.

Actually that was in response to BIFF EXPLODER when he said that killing a Voss user was a "new concept" to me, implying that i had previously seen them as "invincible". So you're wrong on both counts.

Maybe you should check what you say, rather than focusing on what i've said before you tell me to "learn to write".

[Shellsh0cker]

You absolute moron, i said it's not about Voss users being invincible. Learn to read, and understand what you're reading, Christ there are primary school children able to grasp that concept quicker than you.

I'm infinately more skilled than you are.

yep... infinately.......:rolleyes: you are my hero and when i grow up to be a piece of **** i'll want to be just like you.:laugh:

"oh noes the v0sSz0rz i5 1nViNc1bLz0r" i allmost feel feel sorry for you...

u want a lolly to make you stop crying? ahahahaha

Neither of you are going to get anywhere by insulting each other. Nemesis, you're looking for this thread (http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18776). BIFF, learn to read.

Anyway, on topic: the Voss isn't overpowered, just easy to use. There's a huge difference. Because of its ease of use, there isn't a lot of room for improvement. While there are some very skilled Voss users out there, most don't really get any better than when they first picked it up because they're already good with it. The Baur, on the other hand, has a very steep learning curve; it's not as easy to just pick up and use, but in the right hands it's the ultimate infantry-killing machine. This is more of an opinion than anything, so let's go to the numbers. Blank1 has kindly provided us with statistical data that shows that the assault rifles are hardly different as far as time to kill goes. Conclusion: it's what works for you.

Nemesis, how is using a Voss "lowering" yourself? It's a freaking rifle. If you do well with a certain gun, then there's no reason not to use it. Is there "shame" in using the Pilum because it lets you kill vehicles more easily? No. The unlocks are there for people to unlock and to use, not for people to whine and cry "nerf" over. BIFF and SmashMonkey are right: the most balanced thing about the Voss is that you can use it too.

[BIFF EXPLODER]

shouldnt you cry babies go back to your anti voss thread insteadd of trolling around this one trying to look stupid? everyone knows you are cry babies, even you know, but still u keep on crying... stop it, its not funny anymore, its getting sad.

[nemesis908]

Neither of you are going to get anywhere by insulting each other. Nemesis, you're looking for this thread (http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18776). BIFF, learn to read.

Anyway, on topic: the Voss isn't overpowered, just easy to use. There's a huge difference. Because of its ease of use, there isn't a lot of room for improvement. While there are some very skilled Voss users out there, most don't really get any better than when they first picked it up because they're already good with it. The Baur, on the other hand, has a very steep learning curve; it's not as easy to just pick up and use, but in the right hands it's the ultimate infantry-killing machine. This is more of an opinion than anything, so let's go to the numbers. Blank1 has kindly provided us with statistical data that shows that the assault rifles are hardly different as far as time to kill goes. Conclusion: it's what works for you.

Nemesis, how is using a Voss "lowering" yourself? It's a freaking rifle. If you do well with a certain gun, then there's no reason not to use it. Is there "shame" in using the Pilum because it lets you kill vehicles more easily? No. The unlocks are there for people to unlock and to use, not for people to whine and cry "nerf" over. BIFF and SmashMonkey are right: the most balanced thing about the Voss is that you can use it too.

The reason i would call it "lowering" myself is because it's so easy to use, i might as well put my brain into neutral. There's no shame using the Pilum because it has balanced tradeoffs. While it is good against vehicles it takes a long time to reload and leaves you vulnerable to other infantry, also it doesnt come with a near infinate supply of ammo per clip. Another point is the Voss and Baur are unlocks designed to do pretty much the same job where as the Pilum and Anti-Air are designed to do completely different things and have clearly defined tradeoffs.

The only other AV weapons are the starting weapons so they will clearly be less advantageous, though some might have their preferences.

shouldnt you cry babies go back to your anti voss thread insteadd of trolling around this one trying to look stupid? everyone knows you are cry babies, even you know, but still u keep on crying... stop it, its not funny anymore, its getting sad.

The luxury of this forum is being able to post pretty much wherever you want.
It was never funny in the first place, and although nobody tries to look stupid, you excell at it.

[BIFF EXPLODER]

The luxury of this forum is being able to post pretty much wherever you want.
It was never funny in the first place, and although nobody tries to look stupid, you excell at it.

i guess i'm stupid and you are not... (yeah right :rolleyes: ) but u have to admit one thing, they will never change that gun just because some skilless babies want to have 50000 kills and 0 deaths, face it, the guns are balanced, just because half a dozen sore losers get bad rounds getting killed by a gun and then go post how "unfair" the guns are in a forum, it doesnt mean you are right and the other thousands are wrong.

there isnt alot of things i think dice did well in this game, but making the guns balanced is one of them, and i'm an engineer, i only use the voss on city maps and even then i use support alot.

and with all your crying.... i highly doubt i'm the one looking stupid, maybe i'm too hard on you but you have to learn one way or the other.

[Shellsh0cker]

The reason i would call it "lowering" myself is because it's so easy to use, i might as well put my brain into neutral. There's no shame using the Pilum because it has balanced tradeoffs. While it is good against vehicles it takes a long time to reload and leaves you vulnerable to other infantry, also it doesnt come with a near infinate supply of ammo per clip. Another point is the Voss and Baur are unlocks designed to do pretty much the same job where as the Pilum and Anti-Air are designed to do completely different things and have clearly defined tradeoffs.

The only other AV weapons are the starting weapons so they will clearly be less advantageous, though some might have their preferences.

Well, if that's the way you feel, fine, keep eating lead. Because DICE has already said they're not nerfing anything and I doubt people will stop using the Voss because you say it takes no skill. Honestly, you're digging yourself into a hole here. You clearly believe that the Voss is superior to the other assault rifles, and yet you refuse to use it. Me? The Voss was the first gun I unlocked, and I hated it. I went back to the stock rifles within 3 rounds or so, and have used it a total of two times since. You? You admit that it's easy to use, and yet refuse to get down off your high horse to pick it up.

[SimpleGreen21]

I think the best kept secret of BF2142 is that the Krylov is the best weapon of all. I prefer it over the Voss or the Bauer any day. I just wish it was an unlock so both teams could get it.

[BIFF EXPLODER]

every other assault gun is actually better then the voss (i dont like the scar 11, it just doesnt feel right hehe) it depends of who use it, i like the voss because i'm a spray player on city maps, my fav kit is engineer, but anyone that takes the time to aim knows the other guns are better, and they kill more with them then anyone else with the voss.

in BF2142 its the player that makes guns good, nothing else.

[nemesis908]

i guess i'm stupid and you are not... (yeah right :rolleyes: ) but u have to admit one thing, they will never change that gun just because some skilless babies want to have 50000 kills and 0 deaths, face it, the guns are balanced, just because half a dozen sore losers get bad rounds getting killed by a gun and then go post how "unfair" the guns are in a forum, it doesnt mean you are right and the other thousands are wrong.

there isnt alot of things i think dice did well in this game, but making the guns balanced is one of them, and i'm an engineer, i only use the voss on city maps and even then i use support alot.

and with all your crying.... i highly doubt i'm the one looking stupid, maybe i'm too hard on you but you have to learn one way or the other.

You're right it will never be changed, because it would upset the majority. But that doesnt mean i cant complain about it. Skilless, the minority compaining about it are more likely the more skilled players.

The thing is i rarely lose, i cant remember the last time i had a bad score. So this isnt an issue of whenever there's a Voss i have a bad round, it's a regular bout of ******** that occurs with a particular weapon, that if balanced wouldnt occur.

Just because we're the minority, it doesnt mean we're wrong. On the topic of looking stupid, i'm not even going to get into that, i dont need to.

Well, if that's the way you feel, fine, keep eating lead. Because DICE has already said they're not nerfing anything and I doubt people will stop using the Voss because you say it takes no skill. Honestly, you're digging yourself into a hole here. You clearly believe that the Voss is superior to the other assault rifles, and yet you refuse to use it. Me? The Voss was the first gun I unlocked, and I hated it. I went back to the stock rifles within 3 rounds or so, and have used it a total of two times since. You? You admit that it's easy to use, and yet refuse to get down off your high horse to pick it up.

I'm not digging a hole i'm simply stating my opinion, i do not believe it's superior i believe it's unbalanced, and yes it is easy to use that alone doesnt make it better. Yeah i am taking a moral highground on this, because the gun is unfair and believe it or not i wouldnt want to subject anyone to it plus it would massively cheapen the kill. Keep eating lead, i'm hardly the one "eating lead".

every other assault gun is actually better then the voss (i dont like the scar 11, it just doesnt feel right hehe) it depends of who use it, i like the voss because i'm a spray player on city maps, my fav kit is engineer, but anyone that takes the time to aim knows the other guns are better, and they kill more with them then anyone else with the voss.

in BF2142 its the player that makes guns good, nothing else.

Why because the SCAR11 has recoil?

[Raidyr]

i guess i'm stupid and you are not... (yeah right :rolleyes: ) but u have to admit one thing, they will never change that gun just because some skilless babies want to have 50000 kills and 0 deaths, face it, the guns are balanced, just because half a dozen sore losers get bad rounds getting killed by a gun and then go post how "unfair" the guns are in a forum, it doesnt mean you are right and the other thousands are wrong.

there isnt alot of things i think dice did well in this game, but making the guns balanced is one of them, and i'm an engineer, i only use the voss on city maps and even then i use support alot.

and with all your crying.... i highly doubt i'm the one looking stupid, maybe i'm too hard on you but you have to learn one way or the other.

I am neutral on this Voss matter (I have come to realize it is not overpowered, just easy), but I gotta say, YOU are the stupid looking one ;)

Also, nemesis should get an endurance badge :P

[blank1]

Nemesis have you read my AR breakdown?

[Shellsh0cker]

I'm not digging a hole i'm simply stating my opinion, i do not believe it's superior i believe it's unbalanced, and yes it is easy to use that alone doesnt make it better. Yeah i am taking a moral highground on this, because the gun is unfair and believe it or not i wouldnt want to subject anyone to it plus it would massively cheapen the kill. Keep eating lead, i'm hardly the one "eating lead".

Sorry if I made a few assumptions there, but honestly, if you rarely have bad rounds, why do you care? Also, by saying it's overpowered you inadvertently state that it's superior; the assault rifles should be balanced, so if one's overpowered then it has to be superior. If other players want to "cheapen their kills" by using it that's their decision, and if you don't that's yours. It's a free country. And what is this "regular bout of ********" that always happens with the Voss? No, really, please elaborate, because so far you haven't really given us hard evidence, just opinions.

Also, I know Biff is being an idiot, but in his defense, I think the reason that the SCAR 11 doesn't "feel" right to most players is because they seriously screwed up the sound. It sounds like it's firing at 1200 rpm, while it's actually only firing half that fast. Players end up thinking they've put twice as many bullets into a target as they have, and get confused when he doesn't die faster. That's my theory anyway.

[nemesis908]

Sorry if I made a few assumptions there, but honestly, if you rarely have bad rounds, why do you care? Also, by saying it's overpowered you inadvertently state that it's superior; the assault rifles should be balanced, so if one's overpowered then it has to be superior. If other players want to "cheapen their kills" by using it that's their decision, and if you don't that's yours. It's a free country. And what is this "regular bout of ********" that always happens with the Voss? No, really, please elaborate, because so far you haven't really given us hard evidence, just opinions.

Also, I know Biff is being an idiot, but in his defense, I think the reason that the SCAR 11 doesn't "feel" right to most players is because they seriously screwed up the sound. It sounds like it's firing at 1200 rpm, while it's actually only firing half that fast. Players end up thinking they've put twice as many bullets into a target as they have, and get confused when he doesn't die faster. That's my theory anyway.

I care because it's not right, why should some players have an easier ride?

I dont think i said the weapon was overpowered, i said it was unbalanced. By a regular bout of ******** i mean getting the jump on or reacting quicker than a player, firing a good few shots with the baur only for him/her to turn round and drop you in half a second. Or whilst going about your business being dropped by someone at long/mid range going full auto shooting from the hip. Or kneeling and scoping at long range with the Baur firing off a couple of shots for your target to spin round and kill you instantly. There are countless more frustratingly dodgy scenarios where the Voss inexplicably prevails.

Of course i cant give you hard evidence, i can only bring my opinions and experience.

[Whiteplague]

There is already a thread about this please search the forums guys
http://www.totalbf2142.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18793

ROFL you DID link to THIS THREAD AHAH!

but i must say, the only reason people complain about the voss is because they dont know how to counter it. I like the voss and use it over the Baur but thats because im trigger happy and 20 bullets doesnt fit my fighting style, most people in 2142 are trigger happy therefor that is hwy they use it (and because they cant control the baur correctly).It is fine and never needs to be nerfed

btw whats PITA pain in the arse?

[TheRealWolfgang]

Well I will agree with nemesis there - the Voss does seem to be the cause of a lot of insta-death experiences I have. I'm not saying it's overpowered or screaming nerf or anything, but I think there's more to it than the numbers are letting on. Like the G36E - if you compare the numbers it doesn't seem like that good of a gun, almost identical to the M16, but when you use it and have it used on you you can tell it's something special. The Voss falls under that category, IMO, although not to the same degree. The Voss just has a certain something that makes it better than just the numbers would tell you, and it's no coincidence that most assaulters use it as their main weapon and that there are a lot of people who have had similar insta-death experiences with it. Maybe every fifth bullet fired from it is like a golden bullet that insta-kills or something. :p

~Wolfgang

[blank1]

The insta-death experiences every moans about are called "head shots." Say it with me class. "head shots." One more time. "head shots."

I believe the head shot damage modifier is 3x bullet damage at X range. That means that the Voss can kill you in 2 head shots, or a mixture of 2 shots anywhere else and 1 head shot. All the guns do the same, besides the Baur, which will kill with 2 head shots or a head shot and a shot anywhere else.

Such head shot kills seem like one shot because the rate of fire of gun's in BF2142 do not necessarily match with the firing sound. For example, the Lambert sounds like it needs .01 seconds to dispatch 50 rounds, but it actually fires at 600 RPM, which is the same as the Baur and the SCAR-11. Are you dying really fast to the Voss a lot? Does it seem like 1 shot? You're getting head shotted.

[TheRealWolfgang]

And how come other guns don't pull these 'head shots' off like the Voss does? I can't remember the last time I got insta-killed then looked up in the corner of the screen and saw Baur H-AR or Lambert Carbine. Is the Voss the only one able to pull off these 'head shots' that successively?

~Wolfgang

[Argh...]

And how come other guns don't pull these 'head shots' off like the Voss does? I can't remember the last time I got insta-killed then looked up in the corner of the screen and saw Baur H-AR or Lambert Carbine. Is the Voss the only one able to pull off these 'head shots' that successively?

~Wolfgang

Soz thats bull i have been insta killed by the baur, bianchi, lambert, even the engi smg. How they do it? Heck i dont know they even pull it off while i am sprinting........

Maybe its time BFROE infiltrate some sites again :D

[Vikaman]

Its easy to headshot with the voss.... even snipers! ^ ^...

well, its easy to get people while they are sprinting with a machine gun... but I cant see how you can to that with other weapons...

UNLESS

you are moving directly AT the person or away from him.

[The_Eliminator]

Soz thats bull i have been insta killed by the baur, bianchi, lambert, even the engi smg. How they do it? Heck i dont know they even pull it off while i am sprinting........

Maybe its time BFROE infiltrate some sites again :D

So true when i use the Buar the other players always criticse me for saying that it was an instant killm, this is due to the fact that i always aim to the head and a singel bit of health already gone for the player is an instant kill.

[nemesis908]

The insta-death experiences every moans about are called "head shots." Say it with me class. "head shots." One more time. "head shots."

I believe the head shot damage modifier is 3x bullet damage at X range. That means that the Voss can kill you in 2 head shots, or a mixture of 2 shots anywhere else and 1 head shot. All the guns do the same, besides the Baur, which will kill with 2 head shots or a head shot and a shot anywhere else.

Such head shot kills seem like one shot because the rate of fire of gun's in BF2142 do not necessarily match with the firing sound. For example, the Lambert sounds like it needs .01 seconds to dispatch 50 rounds, but it actually fires at 600 RPM, which is the same as the Baur and the SCAR-11. Are you dying really fast to the Voss a lot? Does it seem like 1 shot? You're getting head shotted.

I can accept that sometimes this is the case, but based on the way a lot of players have played throughout the round it's obvious that most arent capable of it. That and it doesnt explain a lot of other instances where you're dropped from outside the Voss' most effective range.

[blank1]

I've had some rounds of CS where I just seemed to be getting every kill with a head shot. AWP, m4, AK, deag, didn't matter. I've been banned a lot on days like that lol. Some times, even noobs or less than great players will be on fire... some days just go well, some don't. The thing is, with a weapon like the Voss, it's a much simpler task for a less experienced player to get head shots, since it's an easier gun to control than the other AR's. However, it's not hard, especially for a vet, to score head shots with any AR.

[Mr. ADHD]

Or you can just unlock the voss.

Thanks for wasting five minutes of my life I won't get back.

Have a great day!

[blank1]

Um, what are you talking about?

ADHD huh... lol

[Tehb2]

Baur & Voss are equal. Voss tends to win beacause not all of people know how to control the recoil with a Baur. It takes skill o.O''

Wow this comment is totally opposite of the purpose of this thread. It takes skill to use any of the weapons. Certainly the ammo count and firepower of the voss may help abit with beginners, but the Voss doesnt truly show its abilities until someone with skill gets it in his/her hands.

I use both the Baur and Voss, but frankly the voss is my favorite because whether on offense or defense, I generally am agressive, find myself alone against 2-3 other players. The baur is good, but unless they are lined up, that kind of shootout is going to get you killed. At least with some extra shots I can get em all, and have.

People claim the voss is innaccurate, and that thread in Tips and Tricks that has all the statistics generally says it is, but I have adjusted to its kick and I can hit long range as well as any weapon. i've shot it out with snipers from sniper distances and still won. Float left and right, snap shoot, and keep the dot on the target and you can still win. Although if available, rockets can help prevent this kind of situation.

[The_Eliminator]

I went on a titan server today when practically the whole enemy team wasd running around with Voss's. Actually only 2 other people were not assault (according to the guy on the other team, the other 2 were, you guessed it recon >( )

I began the round when the shield had just gone down and people had plenty of points already.

I managed with my Baur to go on and get a score of 97 with 48 kills - 11 deaths and got my assault gold badge, i even got the gold medal.

The Voss users were defenseless against the Baur and the 11 deaths were mostly due to me trying to pod over to their titan which was quite far away and then hitting their hangar shield.

[blank1]

mostly due to me trying to pod over to their titan which was quite far away and then hitting their hangar shield.

LOL...

[Mongo Only Pawn]

Personally I can't wait until I get my assault gold so I can rid myself of the assault class as a whole...

[pi314159]

I went on a titan server today when practically the whole enemy team wasd running around with Voss's. Actually only 2 other people were not assault (according to the guy on the other team, the other 2 were, you guessed it recon >( )

it seems every server I play on, over 50% are recon on my team. I would love if more did assault as then *gasp* someone might revive me!! well probably not, as apparently thats uncool or something (actually thats too harsh a statement, but it seems like that some times...)

Personally I can't wait until I get my assault gold so I can rid myself of the assault class as a whole...

meh, I thought that too at first, but then once I got all my badges and whatnot and got Brig. General, I went back to good ole assault. As of now I pretty much play strictly assault and engi, with the occasional recon spree on titan defense

[blank1]

LOL Pi I'm digging your name. Have you seen the ytmnd?

[pi314159]

haha, i just looked it up. some of those would make nice avatars

[Ozendorph]

On my favorite servers it is currently medic-mania. I think this is resulting from the change in healing points...everyone wants to get their silver (or gold) medic excellence badge while the getting is good.

[tagging daggers]

people think the voss is over powered because they get killed by it alot

[The_Eliminator]

Sorry i couldnt read your post, i had to make my way through dust clouds first....

[blank1]

It's a zombie. Kill it.

[Cicchetti]

The Voss, and Baur are s*** Krylov FTW

[Sethonan]

Becuase less people use the baur; I hardly ever use the VOSS; if you look at my statistics I have almost zero kills with the SCAR-11 since once I got a hold of the baur, I've been using it ever since... so statistics for individual players mean squat as they don't truly reflect reality.

I could very well enter a game with a VOSS once, kill somebody in a lucky shot and score a 100% accuracy with it; and actually repeat it many times over.

and even then, we'd need an average for ALL players, all using all the guns at the same ammount of times, over a determined period of time, to get anything remotely useful as an statistic.

[brump]

Personally i have flamed the voss innumberable time and everytime of them I seemed to get flamed back.
Voss has little recoil and very minimal deviation when scoped, plus it's high RoF it becomes the easiest gun to use. ANYONE can use it WELL enough to own. That's why I very rarely uses the voss too, even though I still have more than a thousand voss kills. Here's my assualt rifle kills.
Baur : 20xx
Voss : 10xx
Krylov : 9xx
Scar : 10xx
I only use the voss when everybody in the server is spamming voss and kicking my *** and my feeling the urge to teach these vossy arse a lesson. Even in those small amount of time I still manage 1000 kills, which proves how overpowered the voss is.
To tell the truth, I avoid using voss and krylov whenever I can just to prove myself and to show my pride. I can use the scar11 as well as anyone using voss. The scar is more amazing than you may have believed.
This antivoss community shouldn't be anti-ed at all. Voss deserves to be flamed.

[blank1]

I thought I'd let you know that the Voss's base deviation is 2.5. The SCAR-11 and Baur's is 2.0. The Krylov falls closer to the Voss at 2.3.

The Krylov and Voss can score a kill in 0.3 seconds. The Baur can score in 0.33 seconds. The SCAR-11 can score a kill in 0.4 seconds. The margins are far too small to produce an actual difference in ability to kill. Therefore, it's all up to a player's individual skills and preferences -- the AR's are basically equal.

Please, let this thread die. It was at least 2 months old when it was resurrected.

[TINSTAAFL]

This whole Baur mythification is pure bull. Long time ago, someone started saying the Baur is difficult to use therefore elevating it to a l33t weapon. I'm a nOOb by all means, still I get the best accuracy and most kills with the Baur over the Voss and Lambert. I dunno why, but when using the Voss or Lambert I get pnwd.

It's all between the ears, if you feel comfortable with a gun you stick with it and get better results because one feels more confident with it.

[Yraen]

Personally, I hate the Voss. But that's just because in a 1v1 head-on fight, my Lambert has no chance :p The times I've picked it up or Field Unlocked it, I can see why a lot of people use it. It's a very effective weapon! :) I lean more towards the Baur when I go Assault as I tend to fall into the sharpshooting type roles which the Baur's single shot lends itself well to ;)

[[-NM-]-SS-]

Personally i have flamed the voss innumberable time and everytime of them I seemed to get flamed back.
Voss has little recoil and very minimal deviation when scoped, plus it's high RoF it becomes the easiest gun to use. ANYONE can use it WELL enough to own. That's why I very rarely uses the voss too, even though I still have more than a thousand voss kills. Here's my assualt rifle kills.
Baur : 20xx
Voss : 10xx
Krylov : 9xx
Scar : 10xx
I only use the voss when everybody in the server is spamming voss and kicking my *** and my feeling the urge to teach these vossy arse a lesson. Even in those small amount of time I still manage 1000 kills, which proves how overpowered the voss is.
To tell the truth, I avoid using voss and krylov whenever I can just to prove myself and to show my pride. I can use the scar11 as well as anyone using voss. The scar is more amazing than you may have believed.
This antivoss community shouldn't be anti-ed at all. Voss deserves to be flamed.

:laugh:

Actually your whole post deserves to be flamed. The intent is to beat the other team and you accomplish that with whatever weapon that fits the situation. Dont come off all high and mighty as if using the Bauer some how makes you more noble or more "skilled". The reality is that it makes you an easier target in alot of situations and for that, I like kickin the crap out of people like you, which adds to my win column.

The whole argument is retarded. When you "anti voss" dummies get that idea through your rectally challenged heads ... maybe you will realize it's about teamwork and equipment for the WIN.

[brump]

The intent is to beat the other team and you accomplish that with whatever weapon that fits the situation
Told ya, I got flamed back. When deciding which gun to choose from in various situation, the key is to choose one that can give you the greatest efficiency in gunfights. For example, the baur has been a proven gun and when it's on the right hands, it kills better than the voss. Though consider the fact that baur takes getting used to and skills to manage it well, while the using the voss takes NO skills at all, and that baur can be better than the voss in various aspects, he who uses voss all the time doesn't care whether he's choosing one that suits the environment most, but because the voss might be the one and only one MG that he can manage to kill, and he can't seem to kill anyone anymore with his voss left home. So if you are a skilful player you get the best efficiency from baur, but not from the voss. That's not a matter of choice of MG that suits, rather, the reason people keep using voss is that they couldn't kill anyone other than just to holding the button with the voss, so they pick up voss, to be more specifically, the noobie-friendly voss, to the battlefield.
It has nothing to do with teamwork or equipments or the win, it doesn't conflict with them either when I flame the voss.
Dont come off all high and mighty as if using the Bauer some how makes you more noble or more "skilled"
Yes I use baur and scar for my pride. Using them like people use voss shouldn't be said as asking for vain pride.
I never play in K&P server and I never glitch cheat hax etc, to give me any unfair advantages. I would be glad even in my dreams that I'm a legit player and I never do anything dirty to boost my stat.
Same to voss. I will smile even in my dreams that I would rather have scar than noobie voss to show myself, to prove to myself, I'm not a noob, that I know how to kill other than just holding the LMB.

[Light_Wolf]

Oh yes, the ol' "Voss takes no skill at all.".

Heard innumerable times, it's really getting old. I'm a Voss user. Why? Because it's the one gun that I like the most. Sure, it might be good for the newbies, but they won't survive for long anyway. Any kit, any weapon in this game takes skill to use and survive with. The Voss isn't an overpowered weapon and no one is able to magically own entire squads of people with it.

I have no trouble with guys who use the Baur, but skilled as they may be, I really hate it when they call the Voss a n00b weapon. There is no such thing as a n00b weapon.

[The-Overlord-ehT]

The only times i have ever died to a Voss is when theres either more than two players, i am caught off guard, or the rifle rockets are fired at me.

I am very good, maybe lucky because i dont really feel the baur kick back all that much and so IMO its good to just full auto or single shot it.

The only gun i have serious trouble with against my Baur is the Krylov, its a default gun but can seriously own in the right hands.
:nod:
I agree if you can learn to control to Baurs recoil its amazing but on more than a couple of occasions I've been killed by the Krylov when I've emptied half a clip into someone
Also I find the Voss good on titan defence

[Stalker-NSDQ]

I like the VOSS and the BAUR. I use the Voss more in closed areas becaues of it's rate of fire. Inside a crowded TITAN or AREA the BAUR is GOD =)

So I put some variety in my Assault =) I just got Gold today and can't wait till I have the 60hrs with the MED-HUB so I can play something else !

[blank1]

Well, it looks like the thread is back in full swing and no one is putting this zombie down lol.

[The_Eliminator]

i shot it through the head, but this ones persistent

:confused:

[SonicPixel]

Boring... we've been through this so many times. :dead:

[The_Eliminator]

yea, cant we leave it to rest now, we all have opinions and thats as far as we are going to get here.

[SonicPixel]

Agreed. It simply is a matter of preference and comfort. Choose your weapon and don't tell us all how you are a demi god with it because it pwns all others. That's just lame.

[The_Eliminator]

Agreed. It simply is a matter of preference and comfort. Choose your weapon and don't tell us all how you are a demi god with it because it pwns all others. That's just lame.

But you know my baur will.............perhaps i will leave it at that :D

[SonicPixel]

lawls, that's cool, yo!

[Agent15]

I think someone on the ground fired at me with a VOSS once after he bailed out. I seem to recall destroying him with rockets in AG mode.

[Diamond621]

I have over 5,000 kills with both the Baur and the Voss, so am well qualified to testify on both. Please, on behalf of the community, shut the hell up about the Voss being overpowered. The only difference between the guns is that the Voss has its strength at close range, and the Baur has its at long range. The majority of players are not intelligent enough to play to their weapon's tactical strengths and dictate the terms of their own engagements through superior positioning, and this is why the majority of Assault players use the Voss.

The Voss is a pea shooter with non-existent recoil, and is quick, intuitive and easy to operate, especially at close range. Doesn't require a lot of learning to use, but requires a great deal of talent to use to its maximum effect, as does any gun.

The Baur is a sharpshooter's weapon, suitable for headshots and precision firing at medium to long ranges. It is what an Assault user uses when he has patience and a steady trigger finger, which the majority of players do not have. This does not make the gun better than the Voss, merely effective in different situations.

I hear complaints all the time about new Baur users being killed repeatedly at close-medium range by Voss users, and their beef is that this is not the way it should be. The solution is not to nerf one weapon or even fren (opposite of nerf, you see :laugh: ) the other - it is to STOP FIGHTING THE VOSS USERS AT CLOSE RANGE. The Baur's strength lies at long range, so if you don't fight there, expect to lose unless you develop a great deal of proficiency with the weapon to overcome its inherent weakness for CQB.

In other words, fight to your weapon's strengths, and stop complaining when you lose to a close quarters specialty weapon in...close quarters. In a fight between a Baur user and Voss user, each with an equal degree of visual acuity, hand-eye coordination, and other essential gaming skills, guess what the result is going to be? At close range, the Voss is going to win about 7 out of 10 times. At long range, the Baur is going to win about 7 out of 10 times. Vary these numbers slightly depending on unforeseeable circumstances, if you wish.

Stop complaining, and start getting smarter. Both sides of the argument - the "omg Voss > ALL!!1", and the "omg nerf teh Voss!!1" camps - need to grow up a little. Weapons have inherent strengths and weaknesses, and the player who plays to accentuate his strengths and guard his weaknesses is going to win more fights than he loses in the long run.

Neither gun is superior - it is a matter of the players, the situation and the range.

My $0.02.

[SonicPixel]

...snip...

My $0.02.

Let's pimp it up by $2.48 for being a voice of reason regarding the use of weapons. Your total: $2.50. Don't spend it all in one place, Diamond!

[Diamond621]

Your total: $2.50. Don't spend it all in one place, Diamond!

Sweet. Gonna go and buy me a Coke.

[Cann0n-Fodder]

I've recently abandoned the Baur AND Voss and am strictly a Krylov man...(Clark when i'm forced on EU, or Krylov if I can steal one from a corpse!)

[angrysniper]

I would like to mention that spray and pray is a stupid tactic. If you're using the voss which has such a high capacity clip, you want to take aim, fire small bursts, readjust and burst again. In one or two bursts of maybe 6 shots total you can take someone out. For this reason alone, when using controlled fire, the voss outperforms all other assault rifles (other than the krylov.. god I love that rifle).

Spray and pray is an idiotic way to engage a target. The high capacity clip isn't meant to be used on one damn target.

[Cann0n-Fodder]

I would like to mention that spray and pray is a stupid tactic. If you're using the voss which has such a high capacity clip, you want to take aim, fire small bursts, readjust and burst again. In one or two bursts of maybe 6 shots total you can take someone out. For this reason alone, when using controlled fire, the voss outperforms all other assault rifles (other than the krylov.. god I love that rifle).

Spray and pray is an idiotic way to engage a target. The high capacity clip isn't meant to be used on one damn target.

I spray and pray in extreme close quaters panic style fighting (caught with pants down) and it is extremely ineffective.

[[-NM-]-SS-]

Told ya, I got flamed back. When deciding which gun to choose from in various situation, the key is to choose one that can give you the greatest efficiency in gunfights. For example, the baur has been a proven gun and when it's on the right hands, it kills better than the voss. Though consider the fact that baur takes getting used to and skills to manage it well, while the using the voss takes NO skills at all, and that baur can be better than the voss in various aspects, he who uses voss all the time doesn't care whether he's choosing one that suits the environment most, but because the voss might be the one and only one MG that he can manage to kill, and he can't seem to kill anyone anymore with his voss left home. So if you are a skilful player you get the best efficiency from baur, but not from the voss. That's not a matter of choice of MG that suits, rather, the reason people keep using voss is that they couldn't kill anyone other than just to holding the button with the voss, so they pick up voss, to be more specifically, the noobie-friendly voss, to the battlefield.
It has nothing to do with teamwork or equipments or the win, it doesn't conflict with them either when I flame the voss.

Yes I use baur and scar for my pride. Using them like people use voss shouldn't be said as asking for vain pride.
I never play in K&P server and I never glitch cheat hax etc, to give me any unfair advantages. I would be glad even in my dreams that I'm a legit player and I never do anything dirty to boost my stat.
Same to voss. I will smile even in my dreams that I would rather have scar than noobie voss to show myself, to prove to myself, I'm not a noob, that I know how to kill other than just holding the LMB.

Read Diamond's post. He typed what I dont have the patience nor inclination for. Seriously, you just dont seem to get it.

Have a good one champ.